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RE: Betta tank

FattFishy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:35:02 GMT

Looks like you two have quite the fun time there.

Ahaha... falling off of a stem and falling flat on the ground... but I don't see how he could climb up on the marsilea anyways.

But for me... snails just creep the heck out of me. I just get the heeby-jeebies whenever I see something crawling on my Anubias... I had to kill 3 little pond snails... the guts just gushed out some dark liquid. But it's my opinion.

Have fun with Joker!

P.S. Batman will probably be "jumping" from plant to plant instead of plunking onto the ground.

RE: Betta tank

Nikita — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:24:40 GMT

He crawls around and looks funny.

I've kept mystery snails before, but I've never had as much fun with them. I just get the biggest amusement out of watching him meander around the tank rasping for food.

Unfortunately, he doesn't have the cunning intellect of his namesake, and he doesn't quite grasp the concept of "weight distribution." So he'll try and move from the glass onto a plant only to fall - THUNK - onto the substrate, taking the entire plant with him. I've threatened that if he breaks one more stem of my marsilea, I'm having escargot for dinner.

Other than that, the highlight of having him is watching him eat the fuzz algae that grows on some of my older plants. Ever seen a kid slurping down spaghetti noodles? That's this snail.

That and his fascination with rotten vegetable matter make him quite the character. I thought about getting another one and naming him Batman, and then I thought about all the mayhem and destruction THAT would bring and decided maybe I'll just keep shrimp, thank you very much. ;)

RE: Betta tank

FattFishy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:11:42 GMT

Exactly what does Joker do?

Oops I'm hijacking the topic ahaha...

Are all the questions after? If so, I'm going to hijack it some more.

RE: Betta tank

Nikita — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 20:28:47 GMT

Yeah, that's it. It's heavy on the shrimp, but shrimp aren't heavy on the bioload. I weighed it out, and decided that they won't be overcrowded, as heavily planted as the tank is, and considering the size of RCS. I will, however, be keeping a close eye on my nitrate levels and such, especially after I start adding the neons.

Getting the snail upset my perfectly planned setup a tad, but he's worth it. I'm attached to the little guy.

...and now that I think about it, since when am I going to be able to afford ten red cherry shrimp at one time?! I think I'll have to get them in batches of five, and that will give me a chance to monitor tank conditions.

And if I don't like the way it's going, I'll get Joker his own private setup and he can entertain me endlessly from the luxury of his own zucchini-stocked tank. ;)

RE: Betta tank

FattFishy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:54:09 GMT

So... is this your planned tank stocks?

1 snail

10 ghost shrimp

10 Red cherry shrimp

6 neon tetras

That's quite a lot... at least it seems like it. But these guys are small so don't worry. The inverts can be kept in a 2 gallon heated and filtered.

RE: Betta tank

Nikita — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:14:33 GMT

You're quite welcome. I just love my snail is all. He is tremendously cute, and I'd hate to want to relegate him to scraping nasty brown slime off my tank walls for his FOOD, for goodness' sake. My snail gets premium, high-quality, nutritious...rotted zucchini.

...He likes mold. But so do the French and we call that fine dining. ;)

RE: Betta tank

FattFishy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:08:44 GMT

Thanks Nikita about backing up my point about animals not being tools, rather animals.

RE: Betta tank

Nikita — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 19:02:17 GMT

Yes. Yes, yes, yes...yes. And yes.

I got a snail the other day for the entertainment factor - his name is Joker and he has quite the personality. But I am already seeing that he isn't an algae eater like the pet stores market them. Some snails are skilled algae eaters, but mystery snails - both the black and gold ones; they're both actually apple snails - are not in that family. He'll slide on the glass sucking in the occasional strand of fuzz algae. And once in a blue moon I see him rasp a microscopic line out of a circle of green spot algae. But it grows back in the time it takes him to circle the tank! I mean, he is a SNAIL, after all.

So snails have a place in the aquarium in their own right; mine is hilarious. But as algae eaters? No. Since you have a small tank, try using a toothbrush to get in those tight corners - and please don't put it back in the bathroom when you're done. Save the snail for a larger tank where he can be enjoyed in his own right, not as a tool.

RE: Betta tank

FattFishy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 18:53:28 GMT

I myself gave up on algae eaters because of their size, fragility, etc. The otos kept on dying, the plecos are too big, the smaller plecos don't look good or expensive, the SAE are too big, the CAE won't do anything... and the list goes on. I just use an algae scrubber, basically the only thing you CAN do successfully (besides less nutrients and lighting).

RE: Betta tank

Nikita — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 18:42:09 GMT

Yep, I agree. Algae should not be a problem in your tank if everything is in balance - this is a sign that something in your water is off. Either too much light, excessive nutrients (possibly nitrates, make sure you're changing the water), etc.

RE: Betta tank

princessotfu — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 18:37:07 GMT

I wouldn't put in a mystery snail if the tank is less than about 3 gallons, considering there is a betta in there. These snails can get pretty large as snails go and when at adult size, they almost rival some small fish in waste production. Also keep in mind that if you get one, it will needs its own care, as far as calcium for shell maintenance and a variety of veggies in addition to the algae you expect it to eat.
I'd just invest in an algae scrubber myself, get used to the idea of algae, and maybe reduce your lighting a little.

RE: Betta tank

MtnFishBoy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 18:13:47 GMT

I would say only going with a mystery snail, and make sure that it has a well developed shell. Any snail that has a weak shell, regardless of the species, will probably be killed by a betta b/c they like to peck at the snails.

RE: Betta tank

MillieFish — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:13:04 GMT

What is the size of the tank? Your choice of algae cleaning solutions depends on it.

RE: Betta tank

math-only aquarium — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 15:59:01 GMT

Hello,

Also remember that snails and other invertebrates actually have a lower tollerance of pollutants than do fish. As such, adding a snail will mean that you'll have to do more frequent water changes and more cleaning. If you actually want to keep the snail well, you'll actually create more work for yourself than just grabbing a scrubbing pad evey once in a while (in addition to your normal water changing routine, of course).

MOA

RE: Betta tank

Nikita — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 08:47:21 GMT

Well, buying one mystery snail won't result in a population explosion, since the snail cannot reproduce with itself. Even if it were gravid, it doesn't have anywhere to go to lay its eggs, like FattFishy said.

The problems happen when small pond snails hitch a ride on the mystery snail - within its shell, ON its shell, in the water it arrives in. These guys multiply fast, and will take over the tank.

Also, you can't feed these snails on just algae. Mystery snails aren't the best algae-eating snails out there, and they will need supplemental food besides just algae wafers. You can feed them general sinking tablets, like you can buy for corydoras, but if your betta is smart and hungry (and they tend to be both on a pretty regular basis) it may end up stealing that food, which isn't good for either the snail or the betta.

The solution? Float a piece of zucchini, cucumber, blanched lettuce, squash, etc in the water. Remove it in a couple days or when it starts to mold, but until then your snail will eat it up. The betta can have some if he wants it; since it's not a compressed food, it doesn't pose a health risk for him.

But if that sounds like too much work...get a scrubbing pad and use some elbow grease.

RE: Betta tank

FattFishy — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 08:14:48 GMT

A good type of snail is a Mystery Snail. They have to lay their eggs above water, something they can't do so there won't be any overrides by snails. They won't be attacked (see explaination below).

Keep in mind bettas only attack similar, colorful and long-finned fishes. It's just their nature. Fish that are very similar in the same family anabantids will create some trouble being kept together. Male gouramis will only attack male gouramis, but the betta usually has a broader range. Take for instance, a swordtail. Most are colorful and have a long fin/tail.

The only problem I see is why not just scrub the tank with an algae scrubber? Animals are not tools if taken for that purpose (i.e. algae eating, snail ridding, etc). But if you do want the certain fish or shrimp, then go ahead. It's just that their other "thank you for keeping me nice, healthy, and happy" is eating algae/snails, etc. I hope you understand my point: We keep fish because we like them, not as tools.

Other problem: After the algae is gone, where does the snail get its food? Algae wafers. I've seen some people have trouble feeding their snails because the betta steals the wafer... so every feeding period, they pick it up, put it in its own container and feed it there. I see that as a hassle and irritating...

After the algae is gone by whatever method, try to prevent it.

1. Don't overfeed.

2. Turn off the light whenever you don't view it (don't apply to planted tanks).

3. Move it out of sunlight (if it isn't already).

4. Have a smaller period of light on (ok for low-light tanks). Usually 10-12 hours creates unwanted algae; try 8-10 hours.

Lastly, isn't it less risky to buy an algae scrubber and scrub it quick than buying a snail that might reproduce out of control and overrun your tank?

Betta tank

austin123 — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 07:06:58 GMT

I know that a male betta will fight with some fish so what about a snail? I need something to clean the algea (they eat algea right?) so I thought that maybe it wouldn't get attacked because of its shell. Also if I did get a snail for it would the tank be over run by snails? (My dads did from eggs in the plants)